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Agree with Obama. It's no one's business.
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Obama says family is off limits. Personally I agree family should have nothing to do with politics. But then... why do we care about the candidates' spouses? Why are there kids brought to all these political events? Politicians use their families left and right for improve their appearance. So when something bad happens in the family, shouldn't that be just as public? I'm all for leaving families out. But I sure as hell don't want a double-standard; show the best and hide the worst. That's far worse.
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Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Razor wrote:Killing people is good therapy.  
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Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palin's daughter is not the pope.
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Rank: Fecal Impaction For the Win!
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Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
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RichardAwesome wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palin's daughter is not the pope. The pope is an extreme example of the same principle though. Really I don't see Palin's pregnant child as being a huge deal, I just think that Palin's rhetoric opens her up to making it a legitimate topic of public discussion. Other interesting Palin fact: She was a member of an anti-American secessionist movement that thinks Alaska was illegally annexed by America. Not sure how that squares with McCain's whole "country first" thing, but maybe that's been thrown out with the "experience matters" BS too. Razor wrote:Killing people is good therapy.
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Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
True. You can't always control what bad decisions your children make. The difference between a bad parent and good parent is how they address/correct the problem. There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
Quote:
"Who the fuck is Leon Switch and why does he know we have a dog?" - Mrs. Giller
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Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
True. You can't always control what bad decisions your children make. The difference between a bad parent and good parent is how they address/correct the problem. There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
I get this strange feeling some people want Palin to disown her daughter rather than support her and try to help her.
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RichardAwesome wrote:Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
True. You can't always control what bad decisions your children make. The difference between a bad parent and good parent is how they address/correct the problem. There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
I get this strange feeling some people want Palin to disown her daughter rather than support her and try to help her. yea about that....
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While I can't get terribly verbose about it, this entire debacle has made me laugh very, very hard from deep within my lungs. Anyone that makes me laugh that hard at them doesn't get my vote. It's cinematically prototypical. The conservative, pro-life, christian governmental candidate has a seventeen-year-old daughter with an unplanned pregnancy. tl;dr ENJOY HUMILIATION AT THE HANDS OF THE PUBLIC! GAAHAHAHAAA!!
Lacking any sort of expertise in parenting or psychiatry, I can't say *what* parental forces would allow this to happen, but by some misbalancing of sexual knowledge and responsibility, this was allowed to happen. Truth: Parents are not their children nor vice versa. I know this very well. But parents are nonetheless a very, very powerful force in their son or daughter's mind-scheme. I am more (sexually) active than either of my parents were at my age, but I treat it with the sense of responsibility and dignity that I was taught by them. Now I just want to see the plot from Teeth to work its way into this. VAGINA DENTATA IN '08 Safety + Peace
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Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
That really depends on whether or not Palin herself has judged other parents for the acts of their children.
A lot of people are making accusations against her based on the stereotype that conservatives always judge liberal parents for what their children do. So when they see one of her children making a bad choice on something so important, it's easy to point the finger and yell "hyporcrit" - even if she, herself, has never judged another parent. To the simple minds of many, she's a republican running for high office, therefor she embodies the stereotypical republican behaviors and the stereotypical acts might as well be her own. Ultimately that's the price for being a figurehead of a body of people.
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Rikaelus wrote:Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
That really depends on whether or not Palin herself has judged other parents for the acts of their children.
A lot of people are making accusations against her based on the stereotype that conservatives always judge liberal parents for what their children do. So when they see one of her children making a bad choice on something so important, it's easy to point the finger and yell "hyporcrit" - even if she, herself, has never judged another parent. To the simple minds of many, she's a republican running for high office, therefor she embodies the stereotypical republican behaviors and the stereotypical acts might as well be her own. Ultimately that's the price for being a figurehead of a body of people.
You mean contradiction. Hypocrisy is something entirely different. Hypocrisy is professing a belief you actually don't hold.
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RichardAwesome wrote:Rikaelus wrote:There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
That really depends on whether or not Palin herself has judged other parents for the acts of their children.
A lot of people are making accusations against her based on the stereotype that conservatives always judge liberal parents for what their children do. So when they see one of her children making a bad choice on something so important, it's easy to point the finger and yell "hyporcrit" - even if she, herself, has never judged another parent. To the simple minds of many, she's a republican running for high office, therefor she embodies the stereotypical republican behaviors and the stereotypical acts might as well be her own. Ultimately that's the price for being a figurehead of a body of people.
You mean contradiction. Hypocrisy is something entirely different. Hypocrisy is professing a belief you actually don't hold.[/quote] Either one could fit given the crude stereotypes and assumptions that are at play. One could also argue that it's a contradiction for her to praise family values and then take a job she knows will take her from her family a large amount of the time. But then the simple fact is that you can't have both parents working and retain the "Leave it to Beaver"-era family interaction. Much of that vision requires a constant presence of a parent. I'm not even sure what "family values" means in this day and age...
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Rikaelus wrote:Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Crass wrote:Dick Cheney's Mechanical Heart wrote:Palin has made family our business though through her politics (e.g. she is a big proponent of abstinance-only sex ed). If the pope knocked someone up would it be a "private family matter" like we're supposed to pretend that this is? Palin's daughter is a direct byproduct of the "family values" that Palin advocates as part of her political rhetoric. We're supposed to accept her moralizing BS on one hand and ignore her pregnant child on the other? Palins daughter is not her. Kids don't always do what there parents say.
There is something to be said for laying a good foundation and all that....but no parent is perfect and kids are going to get in trouble at some point in thier lives. It's unfair to judge a parent or thier values on one very blatent and public mistake thier child made.
That really depends on whether or not Palin herself has judged other parents for the acts of their children.
A lot of people are making accusations against her based on the stereotype that conservatives always judge liberal parents for what their children do. So when they see one of her children making a bad choice on something so important, it's easy to point the finger and yell "hyporcrit" - even if she, herself, has never judged another parent. To the simple minds of many, she's a republican running for high office, therefor she embodies the stereotypical republican behaviors and the stereotypical acts might as well be her own. Ultimately that's the price for being a figurehead of a body of people.
Personally, I hold other people to standards higher than I hold myself. I say one thing and do another. I claim that I would act one way...but in reality would act another.
Everyone is a fucking hypocrit. Every single one of us.
In any event, the coverage proves that candidates aside....Democrats and republicans have no moral high ground when it comes to attacking eachother.
Quote:
"Who the fuck is Leon Switch and why does he know we have a dog?" - Mrs. Giller
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Giller [GwDR wrote:]
Personally, I hold other people to standards higher than I hold myself. I say one thing and do another. I claim that I would act one way...but in reality would act another.
Everyone is a fucking hypocrit. Every single one of us.
Erm.. speak for yourself.
I personally hold myself to higher standards than I do others so if I ever do judge them, I'm not breaking my own rule about being a hypocrit. I do, however, often judge people based on the standards that they expect of other people. If they can't live up to the same standards they hold for others then they should STFU and not be judging anyone. That's all part of seeing things from others' perspectives.
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